From MLBTR

I did receive one tip on this topic - my guy says the Yankees are in for a bad day (but Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera are not in the report).

So if it is a bad day for us, how many do you think we have?

14- I wouldn’t be suprised about

Big “G”
Chad Curtis
Tino
Bobby Abreu
John Wettland
David Wells
El Duque
Ruben Sierra
Darryl Strawberry
Jim Leyritz
Mike Stanton
David Justice
Shane Spencer
Robin Ventura

14- I would be really upset about

Don Mattingly
Paul O’Neill
Bernie Williams
Jorge Posada
Jeter
Mo
David Cone
A-Rod
Pettitte
Cleamens
Luis Sojo
Any of the Big Three

I am sure I missed some, 2pm looms large

I’m a bit surprised the team non-tendered Rasner.  He’s a useful pitcher, although chances are either Phil Hughes or Joba Chamberlain may take his role as the long man and spot starter given their innings caps.

As for the Mitchell Report, all these “bad day in the Bronx” lines would seemingly point to A-Rod.  That guy has simply been out of the news for too long.

I posted this in the last topic: “Happy Mitchell Day! Where we ignore a conflict of interest and listen to report based on clubhouse gossip!”

Suffice to say that I wouldn’t be surpised if any MLB player is on the list.

As far as rampant speculation, I think one of the names is certainly Giambi (shocker) and I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see Damon’s name pop up (due to his A’s connections).

The inherent problem with this list is that some people will read it and conclude that those not named in the report are not using steroids or any performance enhancers.  So, if just two or three Yankees are named, it would be foolish to single them out (even against the rest of the team) as “cheaters”.

That being said, I’ll admit that I’m very much looking forward to seeing who is named in the report…

“A report that was prepared by a director of the Red Sox is going to list several prominent Yankees?  Shocking…”

This is why the next several days are going to be annoying in Red Sox country.  Either a bunch of our guys show up in the report… or they won’t, in which case we’ll have to put up with weeks of “well, of course they didn’t, look who ran the investigation.”

(The worst part is that while I honestly believe Mitchell will be fair in this—I have a fair amount of respect for the man, I thought he did a good job as a senator in my then-home-state of Maine—there’s no way I can prove that, so I also can’t just dismiss suspicions to the contrary out of hand.)

I suspect that nothing good will come of this afternoon.  For anyone.

Buster Olney on ESPN this morning seemed to be viewing this report with a skeptical eye. I’ll keep the anecdote he told short, but apparently the primary source of names and evidence (in the form of cancelled checks) is Kirk Radomski.

In one instance, an unnamed player’s agent was informed Radomski implicated him. Mitchell asked to speak with this player and said athlete obliged. When presented with a cancelled check made out to Radomski the player said something along the lines of “that check could have been for pizza, it could’ve been a tip, but it wasn’t for steroids.” Mitchell went back to Radomski with this alibi and after a period of time called the players agent back to say “never mind.”

No one knows what the investigative standards were for this. All we know is that a clubhouse snitch tattled on some guys and that a man with a vested financial and emotional interest in the Boston Red Sox synthesized that information.

In the end we’re going to ask what this report accomplished? It won’t have been to awaken baseball to a problem they didn’t know existed. Everyone is already keenly aware of that.

or they won’t, in which case we’ll have to put up with weeks of “well, of course they didn’t, look who ran the investigation.”

of course, the other explanation is equally laughable: that there were no PED users on the Red Sox. 

i do sympathize with your argument b/c this whole thing was so easily avoidable.

but if you looked up “conflict of interest” in the dictionary, it would list the appointment of George Mitchell as the definition.

and that is NOT to impugn the character of Mitchell, it’s simply that the conflict of interest is so ridiculously undeniable.

also, Rasner’s father says he’ll stay with the Yankees:

http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20071213/SPORTS/112130110

“of course, the other explanation is equally laughable: that there were no PED users on the Red Sox.

As much as I want to believe that of my team (who doesn’t?)... yeah.

but if you looked up “conflict of interest” in the dictionary, it would list the appointment of George Mitchell as the definition.

Absolutely.  I cannot, and will never, understand why he was the one appointed.  It doesn’t make any sense.  Why give people a reason to doubt the credibility of the results even before the investigation even starts?

The appointment of George Mitchell is curious. I didn’t realize how closely tied to not just the Red Sox front office but also the major league owners group. I think there’s universal agreement that Mitchell is a man of unimpeachable honor and integrity, but you’d think if Bud Selig wanted a current or retired member of the Congress to run this investigation, there must have been better if not equally qualified candidates out there.

Yeah, my Mitchell line was with tongue in cheek.  I harbor no delusions that the Yankees have not had several PED users.  But MLB/Selig using Mitchell casts enough reasonable doubt about the impartiality of the investigation in the general public opinion that it can’t be taken seriously, even if Mitchell himself handled this with the appropriate integrity, which I wouldn’t doubt.

I’m fairly certain at least half of baseball players have used something that would be considered a PED.

i also find it extremely curious how swiftly and effectively the Paxton Crawford story was buried by the mainstream media.  it was little more than a blurb for a day or two.

you had a former Red Sox prospect admitting to using PEDs and claiming that he saw syringes out in the open in the Red Sox clubhouse.

it was a potential bombshell and it was completely buried.

I have an awful gut feeling that A-Rod is going to be in that report. I hope I’m wrong, but he could be one of those MVPs on the list. As for no Red Sox ending up on the list—you would think that Mitchell would at least mention that David Ortiz says that he isn’t sure whether or not he has taken steroids.

The new rumor is that Clemens is on the list. 

Any chance we can get Suzy Waldman to read the Mitchell report on a Webcast?

Wouldn’t bet a dollar that they won’t be named:
Nomar Garciaparra
Trot Nixon
Mo Vaughn
Manny Ramirez (I think he won’t be, but… you never know anything with Manny)
J.D. Drew (and the resulting shitstorm would be EPIC)

Would hurt—a lot—to see named:
David Ortiz
Jason Varitek
Jonathan Papelbon

And believe it or not, I’d be very depressed to see:
Mariano Rivera
Jorge Posada
Bernie Williams
Paul O’Neill

I have a TON of respect for those four, and I don’t want that to change.

On the bright side, I’m fairly sure that I won’t need to burn my Tim Wakefield jersey tonight.  I’m feeling pretty good about his chances.

I have an awful gut feeling that A-Rod is going to be in that report.

i don’t know, maybe. but don’t you think his name is too big to not have leaked so far?  A-Rod is a bigger name than Clemens since i think many people had already assumed Clemens used.

95% of the world would LOVE to see A-Rod brought down, so i have to think if he was in there, it would have leaked already.

but maybe not.

The new rumor is that Clemens is on the list.

Yeah, I’ll update the entry with links as they come out.

The new rumor is that Clemens is on the list.
Any pitcher who maintains his velocity into his 40s and any hitter who similarly maintained his power and bat speed have to be rumored to be on PEDs.  Just like anyone with an outsized head (I’m staring at you Ortiz) has to be the subject of the same rumors.  Also, their training partners might get mentioned so if Clemens is named, I’m not shocked if Pettite gets tarred by the same brush.

In only a few hours we’ll know which of those rumors Mitchell decided to credit in his report.

ARod wouldn’t bother me that much.  The investigation is all about which leads Mitchell decides to follow.  Whether his decision was conscious or subconscious, you know which leads excited Mitchell and which ones turned him off. If I had a gun to my head and I had to name 5 people whose names haven’t yet surfaced in any articles, Jason Varitek would be the first person I’d say; but do you think Mitchel would ever follow a lead derived from someone 2-3 levels removed from Varitek the way he would for a Roger Clemens or Barry Bonds? If you were leading an investigation, would you follow a lead on Posada if the same quality of lead is available on Schilling?  I wouldn’t (all things being equal).

I can’t stand A-Rod.  I find immense pleasure in rooting against him at any opportunity.

But I honestly think he’s clean.  Maybe I’m naive.

Wouldn’t bet a dollar that they won’t be named:  Nomar Garciaparra

Why Nomar?  I would have thought his injury history is more indicative of someone who hasn’t been using PEDs to recover from injuries.

As a Yankees fan, I find it difficult to believe there’d be any type of concerted effort on anyone’s part to cover up one team’s PED culpability over another. One thing we’ve learned from the public scandals throughout recent history, the more you try to conceal something, the more likely it is to come out. I would think that big free agent buyers would more likely to acquire players tainted with PED usage than those teams that were more tight fisted with their budgets and player acquisition philosophies. The Yankees are therefore be more susceptible to have their current roster of players on Mitchell’s list.

By the way, I believe the Latin players will be under-represented relative to their contribution to the roid environment due to the difficulty of both finding their suppliers and the inability to intimidate them into talking.  I believe that the penalty for speaking versus the (Mitchell-induced) penalty for non-cooperation is much higher in the Dominican, for instance.  Basically, a “rat” has very little protection there while Mitchell has very little leverage (and information).

i have little doubt Nomar used. 

but i also think more players than not were users.

Nolan Ryan maintained his velocity as a 44 year old.  Perhaps he’ll be on the list as well.

The Yankees are therefore be more susceptible to have their current roster of players on Mitchell’s list.

i think it has more to do with the sources used in the report.  there are only 3 sources for the names, and the primary source was based in NYC.

Also, Hank Aaron hit 40 HR as a 39 year old in 1973.  Perhaps he ought to be named too.

The appointment of George Mitchell is curious. I didn’t realize how closely tied to not just the Red Sox front office but also the major league owners group. I think there’s universal agreement that Mitchell is a man of unimpeachable honor and integrity, but you’d think if Bud Selig wanted a current or retired member of the Congress to run this investigation, there must have been better if not equally qualified candidates out there.

I admit there’s risk in having someone associated with a team in this manner, but I’m sure the Commish figured Mitchell’s integrity, which several of you have been kind enough to mention, would overcome suspicions. I’d also suggest that there aren’t a ton of good candidates out there for something like this. Your reactions here are a good demonstration of the #1 line of attack on the report: why should we believe this guy? A well-liked former Senator with an unblemished career is about as good as you’re going to get. Add in his taste for the job, because he’s a baseball nut, and presto! I doubt there are a lot of guys in his standing to begin with, and of them, I wonder how many of them would relish picking apart Baseball?

I actually hope there are a couple Sox in there (of no consequence) so people won’t say he’s biased… but whatever.

They should have Gary Sheffield run this investigation. His policy is if you don’t stick a needle in your butt, it’s not steroids.

I actually hope there are a couple Sox in there (of no consequence) so people won’t say he’s biased

I would think Gabe Kapler is a lock to be on there, no?

Funny, Kaplers charity is an anti-domestic violence organization. Maybe he has a guilty conscience from beating his wife during a roid rage?

I actually hope there are a couple Sox in there (of no consequence) so people won’t say he’s biased… but whatever.

not for nothing, but if i were Mitchell and i wasn’t 100% unbiased (which i am not saying he is), that is EXACTLY what i would do.

i would list a couple of Sox of no consequence.

gives the appearance of impartiality but does little harm.

i think it has more to do with the sources used in the report.  there are only 3 sources for the names, and the primary source was based in NYC.

I’ve been wondering about that… Radomski was with the Mets in the late eigthies and early nineties, was his base of operations in NYC after he left the Mets? Did he work in the home clubhouse or the visiting clubhouse? And what, if any, did his job as clubhouse attendant have to do with his guilty plea this past year? Basically, for all we know Radomski’s PED involvement may have started well after he left the Mets and may have conducted his business out of San Francisco, near where BALCO was headquartered. I hope the Mitchell reports addresses these questions, but for now, I’m not aware of any indication that Radomski’s illegal activities were based in NYC.

admit there’s risk in having someone associated with a team in this manner, but I’m sure the Commish figured Mitchell’s integrity, which several of you have been kind enough to mention, would overcome suspicions.

and not for nothing, but the Commish has already demonstrated his “integrity” with regards to the Red Sox during the sale of the team to the Henry group.

Basically, for all we know Radomski’s PED involvement may have started well after he left the Mets and may have conducted his business out of San Francisco, near where BALCO was headquartered.

true.  good point, we don’t know.

i’ve been focusing on every report that lists him as the Mets clubhouse attendant.

Kapler, despite having never been more than a bit player for the Sox, would depress me more than some of the guys on the current roster.  I like the guy a lot—he’s personable, articulate (I loved him as a NESN analyst), never once bitched about playing time, was great in the clubhouse, and has always said the right things when asked about (or outright accused of) steroid use.

I realize that it might all be a lie, but I really don’t want it to be.

Leaked supposedly:

Brady Anderson, Manny Alexander, Rick Ankiel, Jeff Bagwell, Barry Bonds, Aaron Boone, Rafaeil Bettancourt, Bret Boone, Milton Bradley, David Bell, Dante Bichette, Albert Belle, Paul Byrd, Wil Cordero, Ken Caminiti, Mike Cameron, Ramon Castro, Jose and Ozzie Canseco, Roger Clemens, Paxton Crawford, Wilson Delgado, Lenny Dykstra, Johnny Damon, Carl Everett, Kyle Farnsoworth, Ryan Franklin, Troy Glaus, Rich Garces, Jason Grimsley, Troy Glaus, Juan Gonzalez, Eric Gagne, Nomar Garciaparra, Jason Giambi, Jeremy Giambi, Jose Guillen, Jay Gibbons, Juan Gonzalez, Clay Hensley, Jerry Hairston, Felix Heredia, Jr., Darren Holmes, Wally Joyner, Darryl Kile, Matt Lawton, Raul Mondesi, Mark McGwire, Guillermo Mota, Robert Machado, Damian Moss, Abraham Nunez, Trot Nixon, Jose Offerman, Andy Pettitte, Mark Prior, Neifi Perez, Rafael Palmiero, Albert Pujols, Brian Roberts, Juan Rincon, John Rocker, Pudge Rodriguez, Sammy Sosa, Scott Schoenweiis, David Segui, Alex Sanchez, Gary Sheffield, Miguel Tejada, Julian Tavarez,Fernando Tatis, Maurice Vaughn, IJason Varitek, Ismael Valdez, Matt Williams and Kerry Wood

Rich Garces

If this is somehow true, it’s simultaneously the saddest and funniest thing ever.

Trot Nixon

This means the 2004 ALCS goes to the Yankees by forfeit, right?

PagsRags, source?

I’m assuming Maurice Vaughn = Mo Vaughn?

if that list is real, and i doubt it is, there is not a single surprising name on the list.

my only question would be where is Luis Gonzalez?  unless that second “Juan” is supposed to say Luis.

i mean, is there anyone who doesn’t think that guy was a user?

Big article on ESPN saying an ex-Yankee trainer gave Roger Roids a couple times

Pujols is the only name i think would bother me.

Pettitte would too, if this were the first time i were seeing it.

This means the 2004 ALCS goes to the Yankees by forfeit, right?

i know you are joking, but Damon would be much more damning.

Selig appointed Mitchell to get Congress off of his back.  Pure and simple.  Mitchell is a former Senator and thus, part of the Old Boys Club that is our Legislative Branch.

You’d have to be high to think Mitchell is impartial.  He’s not.  Even if he was not accepting checks from Boston while investigating steroids, his job was waiting for him and I doubt he wanted to rock the boat.  He wasn’t going to dig too hard to investigate David Ortiz.

Strike 1 for the Mitchell Report.

The report itself is not based on test results, but mostly hearsay by sources who are trying to stay out of trouble.

Strike 2 for the Mitchell Report.

I’m sure Strike 3 will manifest itself when the report is released.

The only winner in this debacle is Barry Bonds.  He has to be smirking right now.  If there is anything that will take the wind out of the “Bonds’ records should have an asterisk group” sails, it is the prospect that the Mitchell Report will show the use of PEDs was and probably still is pervasive in MLB.

If you are going to asterisk Bonds, it will probably be clear that most records in the past ten or so years will need an asterisk as well.

Frankly, I could care less who is on the report.  It will not damn the Yankees organization, or any organization for that matter.  Most, if not all, owners knew something was going on with the players.  However, the increased offensive output was bringing people back to baseball after a brutal strike.  The owners were willing to look the other way.

Throw in the fluidity of player movement and it’s hard to say that one organization gets a bruise if a certain player shows up on the report.  Example: if Johnny Damon is on the report, does that “damn” the Yankees alone?  Doesn’t his time in Boston, Oakland and Kansas City also count?

This whole Mitchell Report is a big waste of time.  It’s sole purpose is to placate Congress and ensure Congress doesn’t go poking around baseball or ruminate about revoking MLB’s antitrust exemption.

Who doesn’t enjoy a good leak?

I admit there’s risk in having someone associated with a team in this manner, but I’m sure the Commish figured Mitchell’s integrity, which several of you have been kind enough to mention, would overcome suspicions. I’d also suggest that there aren’t a ton of good candidates out there for something like this. Your reactions here are a good demonstration of the #1 line of attack on the report: why should we believe this guy? A well-liked former Senator with an unblemished career is about as good as you’re going to get. Add in his taste for the job, because he’s a baseball nut, and presto! I doubt there are a lot of guys in his standing to begin with, and of them, I wonder how many of them would relish picking apart Baseball?

Sure Mitchell is a man of integrity. But so are most judges. And yet no judge would ever take a case if he was a director on the board of one of the parties because it’s practically impossible to remain objective when a person has a serious financial benefit at stake. I understand that it’s hard to find someone to do this report, but Mitchell doesn’t seem like the right guy for the job.

“This means the 2004 ALCS goes to the Yankees by forfeit, right?”

In return, I think 2003 has to go to the Sox (Giambi’s 2 HRs in game 7…).  Call it even.

...

I’m not surprised if Pettitte is listed, unfortunately.  Sad, but not surprised.  There are very few who would surprise me at this point, though.

I forgot about Farnsworth.  Would the Yanks be pleased if he were suspended?  Would they have to pay his salary in that case?  As for the other Yanks, the only one that hurts is Pettitte and given his reputation for integrity - plenty of people may question the report more than the player. 

Another interesting aspect of the list is the number of players who are injury prone, which would lead one to believe that PEDs perhaps are more useful in terms of helping guys recover from injuries faster rather than helping them hit the ball over the fence or throw 98 mph.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3142651

yup, that sale to the Henry group, which the Boston Herald labeled as “The Fix” is cited in this Howard Bryant piece on ESPN this morning (Pulitzer material, IMO). It delves deeply into the conflict of interest that could have been easily avoided by naming another investigator. In fact, one GM said “that he did not believe Mitchell would implicate a high-profile Red Sox player in his report.”

It’s hard to assail Mitchell’s record so far, he’s helped bring the Israel and the Palestinians to the negotiating table. But he’s never had such a clear and obvious rooting interest before. While it’s true that he’s not being compensated by the Red Sox during the investigation, Larry Luchinno has said when the report is issued, he expected that Mitchell would return to his position within the organization and would again be payed.

Also seems the investigation was unsophisticated and uninformed, according to Bryant. Based on the questions asked to team GMs, trainers and strength coaches, they were asked to guess and speculate as to who was using, even if they simply didn’t know.

This whole thing stinks.

I guess its harder to get the Players Association to cooperate with a steroids investigation than it is to help broker peace in Northern Ireland….unless athletic trainers were the key to the whole thing there too.

i wonder if the steroids language in Pettitte’s new contract exactly mirrors the language in the option he turned down.

I’m more concerned about the “evidence” that was used to name names than I am about Mitchell’s conflict of interest.  Don’t get me wrong - it’s a clear CoI and should’ve disqualified him… but even without that the report was fatally flawed from the get-go.

I believe Aaron Boone was on that list too, he did something for us in 2003 didn’t he

If that list is real, it’s a lot worse to be a Sox fan right now. Varitek? And Damon? Damon might be a Yankee now, but his role on the 04 Sox team was a much bigger deal.

I forgot about Farnsworth.  Would the Yanks be pleased if he were suspended?

No one named in the Mitchell Report will be suspended.  The report deals in only circumstancial evidence, speculation and/or hearsay.  If Selig were foolish enough to try to suspend players named in the report, he would have a minor rebellion on his hands.

i think it has more to do with the sources used in the report.  there are only 3 sources for the names, and the primary source was based in NYC.

Exactly.  If the main source of names was based in New York, the “list” could be disproportionately represented by New York players.

Which again, is one of the problems of this investigation.  I respect Mitchell, but when it comes to “naming names,” there’s virtually no standard of thoroughness that could be above reproach.  I mean, aside from how clunky this whole report is from a PR standpoint, what gives Mitchell and MLB the legal right to name these names?  Won’t MLB be opening itself up to lawsuits from the players?  Just the fact that Mitchell chose to name names calls his judgment into question for me.

I guess I’ll wait to hear news of the report, but there must have been a more subtle way for MLB to handle this.  Just because the media wanted a witch hunt, MLB didn’t have to give it to them. 

Nolan Ryan maintained his velocity as a 44 year old.  Perhaps he’ll be on the list as well.

In all seriousness, it’s not inconceivable that Ryan could have been one of the early adopters of PED’s in the late 80’s and early 90’s.

not for nothing, but if i were Mitchell and i wasn’t 100% unbiased (which i am not saying he is), that is EXACTLY what i would do.

i would list a couple of Sox of no consequence.

True, though those guys have lawyers, so you still need some evidence.

Also, I’m only pointing out Mitchell’s integrity, not Selig’s. Nobody has less credibility with me than that used car salesman.

If Selig were foolish enough to try to suspend players named in the report, he would have a minor rebellion on his hands

I’m not sure it would be minor. It’d probably be a full fledged MLBPA revolt. Yatt, post 45 nailed it. This report just has far too many things wrong with it.

i really doubt that list is real.  where did it come from?  why is it filled with typos and duplicate names?

i don’t know, seems like internet BS.

RE #26 Nolan Ryan only used Bayer Asprin to pitch, he was a man’s man

Also, I’m only pointing out Mitchell’s integrity, not Selig’s. Nobody has less credibility with me than that used car salesman.

true, i noticed that upon re-reading your statements. 

i was merely pointing out that Selig’s questionable ethical judgment has directly benefitted this current Sox ownership in the past.

I think the player’s association has established it pretty rigidly that you have to fail a drug test to get a suspension, which is about as fair as you can make it.

I’m more concerned about the “evidence” that was used to name names than I am about Mitchell’s conflict of interest
From what I’ve read, Mitchell took a lot of his investigative team from his law firm.  I’ve worked on a bunch of internal investigations (and I’ve worked with DLA Piper on other matters) and I can tell you that most of us lawyers are really poorly equipped to do an investigation into something like steroid use in sports teams.  A law firm is much better suited to investigating an Enron or a Global Crossing.

I am not saying it is real but it could be someone typing fast from memory, doubt they had it in front of them as they leaked it.  I am sure they were also rushing to get it out.

Once again not saying it is real

It’s pretty much a wash, if those names are really the list.

Clemens was both a Red Sox and a Yankee.  No telling when he started using.
Mo Vaughn - all Sox, has to sting a bit, though not really surprising.
Giambi - All Yanks, obviously no surprise.
Sheffield - Yanks, not surprising.  He’s an asshole anyway.  But he was a fairly productive asshole for the Yankees. 
Carl Everett - speaking of assholes… Sox fans hated this guy as much as we did.
Damon - both teams, though yeah he was more central to the Sox.
Varitek - All Sox, and has to sting.
Nixon - All Sox, and I’d think this one stings too, though less than Varitek.  Those HRs off of Clemens are fair, though, I guess huh? 
Boone - Yankee only, but frankly I don’t give a shit.  The HR was big, but it was the only thing he did - he was otherwise awful. 
Farnsworth/Tavares - each team’s fans generally dislike these guys anyway.
Pettitte is all Yankee, and the one that stings for us.

that used car salesman.

The only from Family Guy?

“This car had 1 previous owner: James Bond!”

In all seriousness, it’s not inconceivable that Ryan could have been one of the early adopters of PED’s in the late 80’s and early 90’s.

i have little doubt that steroid use started in the 1980’s.

PagsRags, source?

It’s copied and pasted from MLB Trade Rumors.

i know you are joking, but Damon would be much more damning.

I didn’t even see Damon’s name in the list.  Missed Varitek too.

On a non-steroids note, does letting Darrell Rasner walk (even though he wants to stay with the Yankees) show that they’re not too high on him? Seems like a strong long man type to me.

i have little doubt that steroid use started in the 1980’s.
Why so late?  Steroids were a big deal in the Olympics a decade earlier. I’d be shocked if no baseball player tried them around that time.  Yeah, I know there was the popular thinking that weight-training made you too muscle-bound but some players (and yes Nolan Ryan was one) were advocates of weight training in the 70s so maybe some players of that mind-set tried steroids too.

I haven’t seen this many people logged in since the playoffs, Who says Football Rules the fall

i know you are joking, but Damon would be much more damning.

He’s on that leaked list too.  Take away the grand slam and the Yankees have a shot!

I have no doubt that Mitchell is a stand up guy.  But the problem with this very obvious conflict of interest issue is that it only takes a small action to compromise the integrity of the whole thing.  All Mitchell had to do was pursue with slightly less vigor a Red Sox lead.  Turn a blind eye in some instance where he would pursue more heavily a lead with another team’s players.

Either way, this sucks.  And now Pettitte.

Carl Everett - speaking of assholes… Sox fans hated this guy as much as we did.

And Moose could have had a perfect game!

I can tell you that most of us lawyers are really poorly equipped to do an investigation into something like steroid use in sports teams.

The Bryant feature on espn.com goes out of it’s way to point this out, suggesting the investigators never understood or tried to understand clubhouse culture: How difficult it is to remain healthy over 162 games, the pressures trainers feel to get guys on the field and pressure players place on themselves to gain a competitive edge. It was simply interested in naming names.

Some of the questions were astonishingly stupid. One GM was asked why he didn’t know what players were having steroids shipped to them and he responded that mail was not labeled with a big “Steroids” sticker or a big “Sneakers” sticker and it’s illegal for him to open other people’s mail.

Varitek

Do steroids aid in game management?

Why so late?  Steroids were a big deal in the Olympics a decade earlier.

oh, you are probably right.  i simply meant that this did not start in 1995 as many people in MLB would like you to believe.

It is hard to manage the game if you are not on the field, and roids are suppose to get you back on the field.  (In less you think Jason is managing from the dugout as well)

That last post was a joke, once I read it again it didn’t really read like that

LaRussa’s gotta be on ‘roids. And Scioscia in ‘02.

What was Pujols’ deal this year? Makes you wonder if he went from steroids, to HGH in 03, to nothing in 07, looking at his numbers.

They don’t, but if Varitek without steroids is merely a switch-hitting José Molina, I doubt his “in game management” would be quite as valuable.

As for Pujols, his OPS+ of 157 in 2007 was lower than usual but in his age 22 season, he had an OPS+ of 151 so it’s not completely out of line with his career numbers.

LaRussa’s gotta be on ‘roids. And Scioscia in ‘02.
Hey, what about Billy Martin?  Roid rage is the only explanation for all those tantrums.

Well, let’s see who’s on the real list. Dunno what Pags’ source is.

Didn’t the scout that found Pujols say he wasn’t sure if he would amount to a great player.  And wasn’t there an ESPN article that said Pujols hates this guy and he got him fired.  It would make sense that this guy found Pujols pre Roids, and then once he took them he just exploded.

If the names on the list is accurate and if that’s the most prominent names on the list, I think the whole report will be anti-climatic. I think a lot of people were hoping guys like Derek Jeter, Mariano and A-Rod will end up on the report. Biggest stars on the most famous team kind of thing. But as others posters have pointed out, these players have been with multiple teams and unless Mitchell’s report can provide irrefutable evidence of when and where the PEDs were used by said player, fans of the teams affected can always claim: “Well, Player X probably did it when he was on the other team, not while on my team.” Again, waiting on the final report, but all “T’s” better be crossed and all of the “I’s” dotted.

Darryl Kile?  Why list this name?  Let the man rest in peace.

Same with Ken but we already knew about him.

Pags Source is MLBTR, and There source is the internet, so it has to be true

<i>his OPS+<i>

So, his OPS relative to other players when everyone was on roids is about the same as when everyone is not on roids? That doesn’t really tell us anything.

He went from a 45-50 HR player to about ~30 HR in 2007.

Woops, I need some italics enhancing drugs.

so now CNBC is running the same list, complete with the duplicate names, misspellings, and typos:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/22243678

bizarre.  wouldn’t a “legitimate” news outlet at least spellcheck?

Not that I necessarily believe this rumor list:

I have always loved Pettitte and I have never liked Clemens.  At risk of writing something incendiary: I’d have a hard time being upset about any conservative Texan being called a self-righteous hypocrite.

Woops, I need some italics enhancing drugs.

Warning: Side effects may include serif damage and decreased font size.

But the problem with this very obvious conflict of interest issue is that it only takes a small action to compromise the integrity of the whole thing.

Right, and frankly, the conflict isn’t that small.  The guy was a paid employee of the Red Sox, and plans to return to the team!  And this from that excellent ESPN article:

Once, before a Red Sox-Yankees game at Fenway Park this spring, Mitchell sat in the home dugout, wearing a Red Sox cap and jacket, obtaining autographs for his son.

It’s not difficult to imagine that Mitchell could know every member of the Red Sox organization personally.  Not just ownership and upper management, with whom he CLEARLY has a personal relationship, but trainers, traveling secretaries, and batboys, the very kinds of people the investigators were trying to lean on.  And to be fair, such a conflict could work both ways:  a Sox trainer might feel more OR less compelled to cooperate given Mitchell’s presence, but either way, it’s a huge conflict of interest.

And again, Mitchell’s lack of sensitivity to the conflict calls his judgment into question.

I think a lot of people were hoping guys like Derek Jeter, Mariano and A-Rod will end up on the report
How much you wanna bet that the Post already had a mock-up back page saying “A-ROID!”

Raul Mondesi

Apparently roids do little for strike zone management.

If the Mitchell report names the Captain of the Red Sox, I think we can all stop questioning his bias, right?

Pujols never hit 50 HR (although he did have 49 in 2006).  On the other hand, he did have two other years where is HR count was in the 30s.  In any event, you can’t automatically assume anything.  After all, A-Rod went from 35 HR in 2006 to 54 in 2007.  What was he using?  Conversely, does this mean A-Rod stopped “roiding” after his MVP season in 2005 when he clubbed 48 HRs?  There’s a certain amount of fluctuation in player stats from season to season and a number of factors are at play.  To automatically assume PEDs are always the answer is a bit too facile.