Blanton to Phillies?  Who do the yanks get tomorrow then?

Who do the yanks get tomorrow then?

Hideo Nomo!

the A’s got a very good prospect for Blanton.

i ask this:

how much better is Blanton than Ponson?

it doesn’t look like much.

how much better is Blanton than Ponson?

Like, 10 pounds better?

Hopefully the change of scenery is what Sexson needs.

man, Santana is getting smacked around

Hideo Nomo!

I’m pretty sure we’ve already had Hideo Nomo a couple years back, and he was Clipper’d.

There’s always pure Asian suck Igawa!

seriously though, Richie Sexson instead of Bonds? really?

seriously though, Richie Sexson instead of Bonds? really?

the word “instead” only works if signing Bonds was ever going to be a possibility.

yes, i think Bonds the player would be a massive improvement for this team.  and i think Sexson will be a minor improvement if he takes Betemits AB’s from against LHP.

no one, including Cashman, thinks Sexson is a better baseball player than Bonds.

but that isn’t what this is about and you know that.

Wait!  I think Sexson is a better player than Bonds!

Sure, Bonds, can hit, but he allows so many runs via bad karma and bad clubhouse presence, not to mention media flap!

Sexson, on the other hand, is righthanded, and really tall, and won’t make the Yankees seem like bad guys.  That makes him a better player!

And he’s white!!!! Always a bonus, right?  Right?

in bad taste.

I just don’t want to see Giambi lose any ABs.

I just don’t want to see Giambi lose any ABs.

I wouldn’t worry about that.  Giambi will likely DH with Sexson at 1B against lefties.  Against righties, Sexson will sit. 
Damon will get eased in as a DH when he’s back next week.

So this probably means the return of Posada the catcher.

Seeing this box score makes me think two things:

1) Boy am I going to enjoy watching Austin Jackson play in Scranton next year
2) Does anyone have any idea why Anthony Clagget is still in AA?

i wouldnt think giambi would lose any ABs. Sexson is going to play first or DH (maybe LF) against probably every lefty we see. Giambi will only be sitting against lefties that he would sit against anyway. Thank god the wilson betemit experiment is over. I dont know why but I hate that guy.

possibly b/c he seemed so full of potential and was such an total soul-sucking failure instead

1) Boy am I going to enjoy watching Austin Jackson play in Scranton next year

I can’t wait to see him play at some point. He was scuffling a bit in the middle of June, like you would expect a 21 year old in AA for the first time to do, but he has had a MONSTER July so far. By next year, he could get some real playing time when the rosters expand.

2) Does anyone have any idea why Anthony Clagget is still in AA?

I’m guessing he’s not much of a prospect but I really have no idea. If he isn’t, they probably want to reserve any extra room on the AAA roster this year for the guys who can potentially help the team next year, like Melancon.

does anybody know what sexsons RISP numbers are against lefties?

That’s probably 15 AB’s this season…

the last 3 seasons would probably be useful

does anybody know what sexsons RISP numbers are against lefties?

That would be an inconsequential sample. I would attach no significance to that.

In fact, I am reluctant to attach any significance to Sexson’s prowess against lefties this season. From the times that I have seen him, his bat speed is slow. He will have trouble catching up to the likes of Scott Kazmir and Jon Lester.

I’m guessing he’s not much of a prospect but I really have no idea. If he isn’t, they probably want to reserve any extra room on the AAA roster this year for the guys who can potentially help the team next year, like Melancon.

He was one of the players acquired from Detroit in the Sheffield trade, and I don’t remember him being talked about as a “throw in” at the time.  He pitched well (though not as well) at Tampa last year, and appears to be dominating AA hitters this year.

I really can’t see what Steven White - whose ship has obviously sailed - offers on the AAA roster right now that Clagget wouldn’t.  Perhaps they are waiting to see what happens with some of the “extra” players on the roster (Britton, Bruney, Milton, and Kennedy who could all be called up in the next month).  Perhaps also he learned a new pitch which is why he is more successful, and they want to monitor it a little more.  I’m just having trouble seeing what more he can prove at AA.

i attach no significance to you

I’m just having trouble seeing what more he can prove at AA.

Nothing, but as you pointed out, the Yanks have a lot of question marks on the pitching side of things, all taking up or potentially taking up roster space at AAA. I think it’s probably just a question of roster size. If they make a trade this year, I’m sure a reliever or two is going to get moved. If he’s not one of them, he’ll probably get moved up. He’s not a particularly hard thrower or high upside guy, and the Yanks don’t seem rush guys like that (Kennedy being an exception because of how polished he was thought to be).

I really can’t see what Steven White - whose ship has obviously sailed - offers on the AAA roster right now that Clagget wouldn’t.

Clagget has no chance of being called up this season to the majors.  there are 4-5 relievers ahead of him still who would get called up before him.

it’s fine to keep in AA for now.

Clagget has no chance of being called up this season to the majors.  there are 4-5 relievers ahead of him still who would get called up before him

Oh yeah, I agree with that.  But getting him into AAA now helps to speed his development so that he may become part of the picture next year.  JB Cox for example is probably #5 on the list of 5 who will be called up ahead of him, and I think he’s there more to line him up for next year.

I suppose after “talking” it through with you guys I can see some legitimate reasons for keeping him in AA.  But White is just wasting a roster spot right now, and I’d rather see Clagget than say Heath Phillips (whose only advantage is he throws with the left hand).

Clagget’s command is apparently not his best attribute.  He’s just not at the top of the list right now in terms of relievers being called up.  I wouldn’t discount him completely for the near future, however.

i attach no significance to you

Given that I am only typing from an unknown location, and may not even be real, I think that is fair.

Given that I am only typing from an unknown location, and may not even be real, I think that is fair.

this amused me.

FWIW, Jackson had a pretty good second half last year also.

Jerry Crasnick in a chat right now, had this to say about Pat Burrell’s fielding:

“Burrell is below average, but catches most everything he gets to, and has a really strong arm.”

I checked the fielding stats on ESPN.  Burrell has made 0 errors this year, so that jives with Crasnick.  He also has 7 assists, leading all NL left-fielders; also jives.  Burrell also has a .906 ZR, second to Pierre’s .911.  Hmm, below average?  You could make an argument that Burrell is the best defensive LF in the NL this year (Pierre has 0 assists)!  Last year Burrell was poor in the field, but since 2001 he looks like he has basically been avg to above avg (just eye-balling the list), which makes last year look like an outlier (injury?).  I have to wonder if this is a case of purely subjective analysis, or if he just got tagged last year as “poor” and that’s sticking.

Either way, I think he should be one of the two OF’s the Yanks target next year for RF (Dunn being the other).

Mike K- I think the Yanks have to fill the holes in the OF via trade.

I think the Yanks have to fill the holes in the OF via trade.

Why?

Because the potential Free Agents suck. I want Cashman to aquire a young outfielder with a good bat and a good glove and there’s nobody with all those skills in the free agent market anymore.

I’m tired of people who constantly over protect our overrated farm system.

I second that why?  Do you just not believe that Dunn or Burrell are good enough?  Or do you not believe they would be interested in signing in NY?

Because the potential Free Agents suck. I want Cashman to aquire a young outfielder with a good bat and a good glove and there’s nobody with all those skills in the free agent market anymore.

Interesting idea.  Whom do you have in mind, and what do you think it would take to get him?

Ah, posts crossing in the (virtual) wind.

I want Cashman to aquire a young outfielder with a good bat and a good glove

There aren’t too many of those who fit that description, who would also be available in a trade.  Also depends on what your definition of “young” is of course.  Dunn will only be 29 next year, is clearly good with the bat, and I think we could use the term, “acceptable” in the field.  Burrell is neither young nor old (will be 32), is good with the bat and in the field.

Via trade…Holliday, but will also cost AJax, who should be able to fill one of the OF holes in two years.  Bay is actually older than Dunn and not as good with the bat or the glove.  I guess throw you some other names you’d like to see the Yankees go after, and what you’d be willing to trade instead.

I guess throw you some other names

From Yoda, everything about comminucations, I learned…

do we really want adam “all or nothing” dunn?

do we really want adam “all or nothing” dunn?

Personally, I’d rather have Burrell.  I like the better defense, and though he is a few years older I think he’ll age better.  Plus, he’s already proven he can play in a city tough on athletes.

But if Burrell isn’t interested or prices himself out of the discussion, I think I’d rather sign Dunn than trade a lot of talent for one year of Holliday or Bay (note I’d be willing to trade for them in-season, if the cost in players isn’t too great), and then ALSO pay a ton of money.

Weren’t the Phillies begging anyone to take Burrell a couple of years ago.  More WOE Mets score more in one game against Cincy then we did in three.

Bay is actually older than Dunn and not as good with the bat or the glove.<i>

<i>Burrell is neither young nor old (will be 32), is good with the bat and in the field.

Burrell is absolutely not good in the field, regardless of what half a season worth of ZR data says about him playing in a LF the size of my pocket. I’m sure his defensive projection for next year will be negative.

I’d go after Dunn because of his age and because of his experience at first and because he’s got a decent arm. Bay has turned into a horror show into the field, Burrell is 32 with just as much of an old player skill set as Dunn and Dunn is more athletic than both of them (He was going to be a QB at Texas before he was signed by the Reds).

So, do you think Cashamn is going to sign Teixera, CC and Burrell or Dunn?

Bay has been a better hitter than Dunn two of the last three years and is better this year.

My bad.  I took a quick look at their numbers on ESPN (ESPN has ZR and I was comparing defense as well).  Dunn’s OPS is better (.925 to .917), but Bay’s OPS+ is better (142 to 138).  Interestingly, their career OPS+ are the same (131).  Dunn is still better defensively and still younger, so I’d rather have Dunn for just cash than Bay for cash+players.

Burrell is absolutely not good in the field, regardless of what half a season worth of ZR data says about him playing in a LF the size of my pocket.

I looked for - and obviously failed to find - some numbers SG ran for the projections several weeks ago on Burrell vs. Dunn in LF.  Burrell consistently came out ahead, I think about half a win per-year or so.  I think Burrell has been extremely *under* rated as a fielder, personally.  If you have some data to back up your claim that would be nice…

So, do you think Cashamn is going to sign Teixera, CC and Burrell or Dunn?

No, not three of them.  It’s really too early to say for sure what will happen, because of course we have to see what happens *this* year first.  E.g. if Miranda keeps hitting in the minors and gets a shot in Sept and does well, they may not need a 1B.  Maybe Melky has a .900 OPS the rest of the way and Gardner over .800, so they don’t need an OF.  They may also make a trade like we were discussing the other day to get a player like Kemp.  Are any of these things likely?  No, but they sure *could* happen.

If I had to bet now, I’d say they go hard after CC and one of Burrell/Dunn, and make an offer to Tex but probably nothing serious.  As Cashman tries to get younger in other spots, he’s going to need 1B and DH open to start shuffling older players over the next several years (including probably ARod).

So, do you think Cashamn is going to sign Teixera, CC and Burrell or Dunn?

Not sure who you’re asking, I don’t know that Cash is going to sign CC. I have to think he’s wary of investing so much into a long term contract with a pitcher, even if he’s a big lefty under 30. Pitching is where the Yanks feel good about developing players, Cashman may be more interested in biding his time with a placeholder (hopefully Moose) instead of going big. It’s possible, I’m just not sure.

I think he definitely makes a run at either Dunn or Tex, maybe both. They’re young, one is a big time hitter with power and plate discipline, the other is as much of an all-around player as you can be at first, short of being Albert Pujols. I’m also not concerned about blocking DH or 1st the way some here are. I just don’t see the logjam others do.

I think it’s pretty unlikely Cashman goes after a guy with a reputation for looking at strike threes and playing for contracts who will be 32 next year. The guy is not going to be well liked by the fans and will probably age poorly.

I hope we sign CC before we sign Teixera or Dunn.

Just say *no* to Burrell.

If you have some data to back up your claim that would be nice…

Sure, although you’ve proven capable of looking up ZR, so I’m not sure why you wouldn’t just do it here. This year, Burrell is 2nd in the NL in ZR. Last year, he 10th out of 11. The year before he was 8th out of 11. The year before he was 4th out of 9th. He led the NL in errors two out of the last three years as well, which matters more for OFers because their is a chance they were on throws which suggests poor instincts, which Burrell has or an erratic arm, which I don’t think he has. So three years ago, before Burrell turned 30, he was a decent LFer. That holds true for most of his 20s. Then he progressively got worse, as you would expect for an aging, not especially athletic LFer. Then, this year he turns into a Gold Glover, which stands out just as much as his sudden shift to All-Star hitter. Now, here’s my question. Do you believe Burrell has made some fundamental shift in his game that has allowed him to excel beyond all of his previous performance of his career, both in the field and at the plate, at age 31? Or is he simply having a career year, as many ballplayers do between 26 and 32, in which everything is working out for him and it happens to be his contract year? I’m betting it’s the latter.

lets not forget cashman might not be the GM this winter. I GUARANTEE that if the yankees do not make the world series little stein will shell out whatever it takes to put the hefty lefty in pinstripes. And seeing the way this season is going ....hello CC.

As unlikely as it was 2 months ago…I think they will decline giambis option and probably try to sign him for $7-12M.

viva la ‘stache

i think the yankees will absolutely go hard after CC and then try to use some of the pitching prospects to get a young position player. 

not sure of who that would be, but that’s my guess. 

i don’t think they’ll get Teixeira b/c i think another team will be willing to spend a crazy amount on Tex but most teams won’t be willing to go as high for CC.

I’m also not concerned about blocking DH or 1st the way some here are. I just don’t see the logjam others do.

I see both sides.  On the one hand, Tex is an excellent player.  But, I seem to remember hearing somewhere though that Boras is starting to float 10yrs and some ridiculous $$ amount (like 250 million).  I don’t know if we need ANOTHER contract like that (one was more than enough).

On the other hand, even assuming that Giambi is gone after this year, and Matsui and Damon the year after, there still will be concerns about Posada for the next two years, and after that probably Jeter and ARod as well.  Not to mention if they sign either Dunn or Burrell, one of them will eventually need to move to 1st or DH.  Perhaps if I take the time to look at when all of the contracts are up, it may work out OK that there won’t be more than one player at a time that needs to DH (e.g. Matsui next year, Posada the two years after, maybe ARod after that, etc).

I think it’s pretty unlikely Cashman goes after a guy with a reputation for looking at strike threes and playing for contracts who will be 32 next year. The guy is not going to be well liked by the fans and will probably age poorly.

I don’t buy the, “playing for contracts” argument.  I think there was a study that debunked that.  Some players have career-years in contract-years, some play awful.  I don’t think Cashman cares as much about reputation as reality.  As for liked by fans…if he plays well and the Yankees win (especially if he has a clutch hit or two), the fans will like him. 

Really what it all comes down to is the contracts.  I wouldn’t want to give Burrell more than a four year deal.  He may be looking for 5 or 6; I’d say at that point, it is, “see ya”.  If Dunn then is willing to take 4 (and he probably isn’t either), I’d go that way.

“i think the yankees will absolutely go hard after CC and then try to use some of the pitching prospects to get a young position player. 

not sure of who that would be, but that’s my guess. 

i don’t think they’ll get Teixeira b/c i think another team will be willing to spend a crazy amount on Tex but most teams won’t be willing to go as high for CC. “

Could not agree more. Also, I like the point someone made about having DH and 1B relatively open for the aging superstars

Please no! No CC Slobathia. He’s 290 now, the big contract and, ouch. A man set for a fast & furious decline.

He’s 290 now, the big contract and, ouch. A man set for a fast & furious decline.

i believe the Hardball Times did a study that showed overweight pitchers actually tend to be MORE durable.

does anyone know what i am talking about or have a link?

if i could remember who wrote it, i could find it.

On the other hand, even assuming that Giambi is gone after this year, and Matsui and Damon the year after, there still will be concerns about Posada for the next two years, and after that probably Jeter and ARod as well.

Jeter and A-rod will be able to play the OF until they’re 40 and 65 respectively. They’ve got the athleticism and the arms for it. I don’t know if Jeter’s bat will bounce back to enable him to play a corner, but I am positive A-rod will be able to stick in the OF as long as he’s interested in playing. I don’t believe HOF, athletic, up the middle ballplayers like these guys will ever be that limited in the field. If they’re flipping Posada, and Dunn between DH in two years, with Dunn playing some first and some LF/RF, I don’t think that’s a problem. I think it will be a while before Tex needs to play DH.

As for liked by fans…if he plays well and the Yankees win (especially if he has a clutch hit or two), the fans will like him.

Except we know that isn’t true. See A-rod, 2005-first half of 2007.

I don’t buy the, “playing for contracts” argument.

I don’t either. But that’s his rep and it will absolutely brought up when Burrell does not hit as well in NY as he did this year in Philadelphia.

i have no problem with CC being fat…more of him to love.

His 250+ innings last year did cause him to start slowly this year.

does anyone know what i am talking about or have a link?

I remember it as well, do not have a link though.

i cant wait for the game tonight. Im leaving work extra early so I can pregame at Stan’s.

Do you believe Burrell has made some fundamental shift in his game that has allowed him to excel beyond all of his previous performance of his career, both in the field and at the plate, at age 31? Or is he simply having a career year, as many ballplayers do between 26 and 32, in which everything is working out for him and it happens to be his contract year? I’m betting it’s the latter.

Defensively, I think he is playing a little above his head.  Just like last year I think was an anomoly (injury, unlucky, whatever).  I think he is closer to previous years.  Yes he was 8th a couple of years ago, but we (or at least I) don’t know what average was so that doesn’t tell the whole story.

And no, I don’t expect him to put up a 150 OPS+ this year.  I would expect him to be more in the 120-130 range that he seems more suited to.  I’m sorry if I come off as thinking that Burrell is going to be an All Star, because I don’t expect that.  I think he’ll be a good player in the OF for the next several years while the Yankees (hopefully) groom some younger OF in the minors.

He and Dunn are actually very similar players over their careers.  They both walk and strikeout a lot (Dunn does more of each), with good power (Dunn a little more).  In my mind, Dunn will be a little better offensively, and Burrell a little better defensively.  I really think Dunn is going to look for (and probably get) a bigger contract, so I’d rather look at Burrell.

Yes he was 8th a couple of years ago, but we (or at least I) don’t know what average was so that doesn’t tell the whole story.

Huh, looking it up, his ZR (per Dial, which is the same method SG uses, I think) was right at average that year. So average, awful, great his last three counting this one. I would have thought that first one was below average, so he’ll probably project average (aging adjustment will probably cancel out the edge this year will have over last in the weighted average).

He and Dunn are actually very similar players over their careers.

Which is why I want Dunn, he’s the younger and more athletic one of two similar players. And he will absolutely murder the Blue Jays.

I really think Dunn is going to look for (and probably get) a bigger contract, so I’d rather look at Burrell.

I’ve learned that I am horrible at being able to determine who will get what contract. I just don’t have the ability to figure it out, I’m always surprised, so I did my evaluation without considering it. If Dunn wants 10 mill more a year, or 4 more years than Burrell or something, then that absolutely has to be weighed and then Burrell is the better choice. I just don’t know what to expect. If their demands are equal, or if Dunn wants an extra year or two (because he’s younger), I would pick Dunn.

from neyer on sexson:

Well, yes: .344 is impressive, and undoubtedly a number that caught Brian Cashman’s eye. That’s in the grand total of 71 plate appearances, though. Last year, in 120 plate appearances against lefties, Sexson batted .238 with only four home runs. The year before that—and you’re not going to believe this—Sexson batted just .204 in 163 plate appearances against the southpaws. Obviously, the more plate appearances you look at, the better the read on a player’s true ability. And over these past three seasons, Sexson’s slash stats against lefties are .244/.347/.469 in 354 plate appearances.

And over these past three seasons, Sexson’s slash stats against lefties are .244/.347/.469 in 354 plate appearances.

What a relief they grabbed Sexson instead of Bonds.

i believe the Hardball Times did a study that showed overweight pitchers actually tend to be MORE durable.

Didn’t say anything about grossly overweight I’d bet.

Gardner has a 98 OPS+ in his last 7 days, but it’s only 11 PAs.

Sexson will get a big boost not playing in SafeCO, which is murder on RH hitters. He hit .178/.267/.256 at home and .260/.363/.512 away. I don’t expect the away #s, but SafeCo’s effect on him cannot be ignored. For his career, he’s hit .230/.319/.457 there. The only year he’s hit there was his first year in Seattle.

does anyone know what i am talking about or have a link?

I think this is the one you are talking about?

Except we know that isn’t true. See A-rod, 2005-first half of 2007.

#1) Arod will *always* be a unique case #2) I suppose I should have clarified that more with, “win in the post-season”.  I think he’ll be liked by fans the first year as long as he is playing well and the Yankees winning, until/if they get to the post-season.  Then how he is regarded going forward will be determined by how he plays there.  Pretty much true for any Yankee in the last decade, no?

If their demands are equal, or if Dunn wants an extra year or two (because he’s younger), I would pick Dunn.

I’d agree with that, up until one extra year.  Two extra…eh.  Maybe I’m making it up, but I seem to remember there being some concern about Dunn playing in the larger east-coast markets as well.  Sometimes there is nothing to that (people were concerned about ARod and he has arguably had his best two years in NY), but sometimes there is a lot to it.

And over these past three seasons, Sexson’s slash stats against lefties are .244/.347/.469 in 354 plate appearances.

And Betemit in the last three years is .227/.277/.354 against lefties.  What’s the problem?

Amen to that.

“What a relief they grabbed Sexson instead of Bonds.”

Right, why pick up a guy who can play now and isn’t going to jail next year, a guy whose hiring won’t embroil all your organization and fans in recriminations for seasons to come?

</i>And over these past three seasons, Sexson’s slash stats against lefties are .244/.347/.469 in 354 plate appearances. </i>

not for nothing, but given the Yankees current lineup against LHP, isn’t this STILL a huge upgrade??

Neyer writes .347/.469 like it’s a huge negative.

it’s not great, but what does it look like next to Betemit’s line vs. LHP???

and yes, all of this assumes Bonds was not an option for “other” reasons.  i would also prefer Bonds.

Tall pitchers, we find, are slightly worse-off than short pitchers, and overweight pitchers tend to perform better than their skinny brethren. Given that overweight pitchers also survive for much longer time periods in the major leagues, all else being equal, invest in fat guys. But generally, all else is not equal, in which the case the answer should be obvious: Go for the better ballplayer, always.

a guy whose hiring won’t embroil all your organization and fans in recriminations for seasons to come

But will result in production of an inordinate number of outs.

Glad to see the Yankees have their priorities straight. It is to employ players having a squeaky clean image.

Oh, this is also a team that employed Darryl Strawberry and Dwight Gooden, who played important roles for WS championship teams.

Mike K beat me to it on Betemit vs. Sexson

Sam I am with you.

yeah, he beat you to betemit punch but an .800 OPS for Sexson is not likely to happen anyway when he’s dead cold playing 2 days a week. So I’m very YAWN on this news. I’ve seen numerous Seattle games the last few years and the one other thing I know about him is that he will strike out a TON. And he looks silly cause he’s so damn tall.

Bonds looks like he’ll be clear to play through the fall and he can actually hit.

plus i added bonds to my fantasy team in hopes that it will say NYY and 60 RBI’s by years end.

“Glad to see the Yankees have their priorities straight. It is to employ players having a squeaky clean image.

Oh, this is also a team that employed Darryl Strawberry and Dwight Gooden, who played important roles for WS championship teams.”

Having DDTed, lawn-mowered, Foremangrilled, and then urinated on that strawman you man, did you really have to jump up and down on what was left?  Esp. since it still doesn’t put Bonds on the field with Posada and Giambi anytime soon.

“strawman you man”

read,
strawman you made or built or something.

I HATE Straw Man!  Let’s get him!

No, just that history of sports is replete with examples where people of dubious character and reputations have been employed by sports teams.

For all his troubles, Bonds has only been indicted until now, and that too for telling a lie. He has not been convicted, although that probably will happen. And if he does go to jail, it will be because presumably he swore on a Bible, and told a lie. If swearing on Bible was not involved, it would count as diddly. Just look at Jason Giambi.

The only acknowledgment that Yankees would do by signing Bonds is that he is a baseball player with usable skills. They are not condoning his indiscretions by that act, or abetting it. There is a full MLB drug testing procedure in place that NY Yankees comply with, and that Barry Bonds would be subject to.

Are we gonna have a chatter tonight?

“The only acknowledgment that Yankees would do by signing Bonds is that he is a baseball player with usable skills”

I think the Yankees SHOULD sign Bonds, but you just cannot pretend that there would not be a media circus, that the Yankees would get a lot of flak, and that it would be a distraction to the players.  Just for starters, in addition to all the OTHER press attention, now every Yankees would have to answer daily questions about Barry.

I actually think Torre could have handled Bonds & the hoopla well.  Girardi maybe not so much. 

Your points are reasonable, but the media and fans are filled with unreasoning people.  And that does translate back to team performance.

“people of dubious character and reputations”

... and making the strawman drink Jaegermeister…

[Unconcern for the integrity of the justice system snipped]

Some good stuff to read for those calling for Bonds - couldn’t find the most relevant link, regarding Bonds’s actions in getting those drugs and hiding the evidence.

If Bonds had lied about getting a blowjob in an entirely politically-driven discovery session, then you’d have a point.  But, well, he didn’t, and you don’t.  If he wasn’t indicted for obstruction of justice in an investigation of great moment to the game, you might have an argument, but, well…

It is ridiculous to interprets most of the calls on this board to sign Bonds as defenses of his character and behavior.

Oops . . . “interpret.”
.

Bonds, Schmonds. T minus ~50 minutes until meaningful baseball starts again! 

I feel like a dying man in the desert who’s crawled over yet another dune and finally saw the oasis.

LaRussa is a drunk who is partially responsible for the death of one of his players.  Brett Myers beat his wife.  Luis Polonia had sex with a minor.  Pete Rose bet on baseball, yet many people including my father in law loves Rose (and hates Bonds, BTW).  Albert Belle corked his bat and Jason Grimsley helped him cover it up.  Hundreds of players took greenies.  Steve Howe was suspended what, 7 times for cocaine?

Etc, etc.

Bonds isn’t convicted yet.  He can still play ball.  Let’s sign him.  It will be a circus, which will be negative, but I think on balance it’ll help the team win.

“finally saw the oasis”

It’s a mirage.  The scoring drought will continue.

Gee, thanks for destroying my fantasy

If Bonds had lied about getting a blowjob in an entirely politically-driven discovery session, then you’d have a point. But, well, he didn’t, and you don’t.

I see, this is only the specific instance when I might have a point. Great call. And who is the authority determining this, by the way?

If he wasn’t indicted for obstruction of justice in an investigation of great moment to the game, you might have an argument, but, well…

Maybe I missed it, but what was the great moment to the game that was being investigated?

From what I recall, the investigation was whether certain banned (by USDA, not MLB) substances, produced by a certain firm was being used by a few select athletes, presumably with the purpose of enhancing their performances. Probably I am misinformed, but is that not correct?

... but you just cannot pretend that there would not be a media circus, that the Yankees would get a lot of flak, and that it would be a distraction to the players.

To be clear, I am not pretending that. All that you said will be there. My only point is that Yankees have done this before, harboring spouse abusers and drug abusers with the purpose of winning a championship, and said reasons did not get in the way. But I see the practical reasons that you cite.

However, to claim a moral high ground after that glorious history is dubious at best, hypocritical at worst.

but what was the great moment to the game that was being investigated?

I think he meant “great moment” as in “great import(ance)”

“Etc, etc.”

None of which is relevant to my argument, some points having incidentally been explicitly refuted above or in the previous trainwreck thread.

“And who is the authority determining this, by the way?”

This is pounding the table.

Anyway, it’s not going to happen, and if it does we can worry about it then.  Till that point calls for Bonds are equivalent to calls for Bugs Bunny and his slow pitch.

“to claim a moral high ground”

Which I wasn’t—but I think you were directing that at rilkefan.

“previous trainwreck thread”

Sorry, rilke, haven’t been around in a few days so I probably missed some excellent points made by you.  However, I think we are going to remain on opposite sides of this.

Just for starters, in addition to all the OTHER press attention, now every Yankees would have to answer daily questions about Barry.

Media hoopla regarding Bonds will be offset by the reduced attention for why the offense suck crap, and why the Yankees may miss the postseason.

Anyway, it’s not going to happen, and if it does we can worry about it then.

Fair enough.

Till that point calls for Bonds are equivalent to calls for Bugs Bunny and his slow pitch.

By extension, any potential call for any player move that has not materialized yet would fit this description. So, we might as well give all “potential Yankee move” discussion a rest.

Which I wasn’t—but I think you were directing that at rilkefan.

That would be correct.