Thursday, March 6, 2008

Interview with Jonathan Mayo

I’m still working on my bench preview, and I apologize to those who are dying to see Chris Woodward’s projections.  I should have that post up by tomorrow.  In the meantime, here’s a change of pace from the previews and projections.

Jonathan Mayo from MLB.com has written a book called Facing Clemens about, shockingly enough, facing Roger Clemens.  You can get more information about the book at Jonathan’s website.  Jonathan was gracious enough to answer a few questions for me about his book and about Clemens in general.

1. Putting aside the PED issue for now, how did Clemens evolve from his debut through the latter part of his career?  Were you able to inverview any players that got to face him over a significant stretch of time and what did he do differently to adjust as he got older?

One of the most amazing things about him was how much he evolved over time. In Toronto, it was the development of the split-fingered fastball. Then when he was with Houston, he added a cutter. As he got older, he became more efficient. He’d always been a good pitcher - not just a thrower - even when he first came up. But he gained a better understanding of how to work through innings more quickly. He knew he couldn’t pile on the innings like he used to, so in order for him to be effective, he had to throw less pitches. During stretches of his time in Houston, he almost pitched like a groundball artist. I did talk to several players who faced him over long stretches of time. Cal Ripken Jr. played in the AL East with him for 17 years and talked at length about what the splitter did for him. Chipper Jones faced him for the first time in Toronto, but got to compare and contrast those initial meetings to some of the ones they had in the division series battles between the Astros and Braves while Clemens was there.

2. What player(s) had the most success against Clemens, and what do they attribute it to?

Ken Griffey Jr. hit him very well, especially when both were in the American League. There were some hitters who might have been better - Jim Thome had ridiculous numbers, but didn’t want to talk for the book - but Junior really “owned Clemens” early on. I don’t know that there was any one thing that worked. Junior had the benefit of having his dad providing some insight. Senior had faced Clemens a few times and since they had similar swings, that no doubt was helpful. More than anything, the key to hitting Clemens seemed to be getting him early. That became even more vital with the splitter and cutter being added in. If you fell behind, forget it. Junior learned that he needed to lay off the splitter and did a good job at identifying it more often than not. But even he didn’t do well once he moved to Cincinnati. More than anything, this was just a best vs. the best kind of thing and in this instance, Junior came out on top more than most other hitters have.

3. What player(s) had the least success against Clemens, and what do they attribute it to?

That distinction belongs to Torii Hunter, who - including the postseason - has gone 0-for-28 against Clemens in his career. I have to give Hunter a lot of credit for his willingness to talk to me at all about this and he was extremely funny and gracious. More than anything, Hunter said it was the splitter. He was always told that you had to get Clemens early and just never could. Then if there was ever two strikes, he knew he was done. Even if he knew the splitter was coming, Hunter felt that pitch was deadly particularly to right-handed hitters.

4. In terms of deception/stuff/style, what pitchers were most similar to Clemens?

People always want to make the Nolan Ryan comparisons, but in many ways that doesn’t work because Clemens was a more complete pitcher from the get-go. Yes, both he and Ryan were from Texas and were power pitchers who were tireless workers and used their legs to derive much of that power. But Clemens never had the command issues Ryan dealt with. He had a good feel for the strike zone right from the get-go. In a lot of ways, I think Clemens should be compared more with Tom Seaver for that reason (As a related aside, if you look at the similarity scores posted by baseball-reference.com, he comes out as most similar to Greg Maddux - not stuff-wise, obviously, this is completely statistically based - with Seaver No. 2.).

5. According to the hitters you interviewed, what was Clemens’s best pitch?

It depended on when they were facing him. At the beginning, it was the explosive fastball. Then it really became the splitter. Probably from 1997 on, the splitter was his best pitch, even if it took a couple of years for it to become his main out pitch. More than any one pitch, though, it was his command and presence that made everything that much better. The fact he could locate that high-octane fastball to either side of the plate made it even tough to hit.

6. What pitchers (if any) were considered tougher to face than Clemens?

Almost everyone put Clemens at or near the top of the list of greatest pitchers of this, or any generation. I’d say only Gary Carter, who only faced Clemens in the nascent stages of the Rocket’s career, didn’t rank him like that. It’s not that Carter didn’t see talent, but in 1986, Clemens was impressive but hadn’t done it annually. Carter was partial to Seaver, Steve Carlton and maybe Bob Gibson.

7. Did any of the players interviewed actually fear that Clemens would head-hunt if they got too comfortable at the plate?

I don’t know if there was fear, but there was knowledge that he’d move you off the plate if he felt it necessary. Chipper Jones told a great story about being dusted after asking the umpire to check the ball following a splitter in the dirt. It was the beginning of Chipper’s career and he didn’t know any better. Most, though, saw it as a part of the game and just one more thing to store in your mind when trying, and usually failing, to hit the guy.

8. Do you think Clemens did use PEDs, and if so how much of a difference does that make in how you view his career?

Ahh, the $64,000 question. It’s awfully hard not to think he used something at this point, isn’t it? The Pettitte testimony was particularly damning, in my opinion. I’d love to be wrong, and not just because I wrote the book. That being said, if you really look at his career and what he accomplished, he’s still a Hall of Famer based solely on what he did on the field. If he had retired after the 1997 season, he probably would have HOF numbers. Figure that he would’ve continued to pitch, even if not for as long without the help of PEDs. His numbers with the Yankees weren’t extraordinary. They weren’t bad, but nothing earth-shattering. Had he pitched around what he was doing in the first half of 1998, for instance - a 3.55 ERA - for another five years, we’re talking about a guy who probably would’ve finished with about 270 wins and an ERA around 3.00. There’s no doubt his legacy is forever tarnished and it’d be awfully hard to forgive someone for taking a shortcut, but I still would say he’s one of the greatest pitchers I’ve ever seen.

Thanks to Jonathan for the interview, and again, you can visit his site at www.jonathanmayo.net/ if you are interested in learning more about the book.

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